[all] Koilines spyruokles. Kur pirkti?

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[all] Koilines spyruokles. Kur pirkti?

Post by samis_p » Tue Apr 16, 2013 4:37 pm

Kur galima Lietuvoj isigyt koiliniu spyruokliu? Radau xtra.lt, bet ten 60mm diametro - per mazos. Reikia min 63mm (2.5''). Radau UK, bet sakau gal kazkur Lietuvoj butu pigiau (bent ant siuntimo sutaupyt, nes gaunasi apie 200lt uz siuntima).
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Re: [all] Koilines spyruokles. Kur pirkti?

Post by Mariuzzzz » Tue Apr 16, 2013 5:25 pm

O darytos netinka?
Geriau pilvas nuo alaus, nei kupra nuo darbo :D

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Re: [all] Koilines spyruokles. Kur pirkti?

Post by samis_p » Tue Apr 16, 2013 5:52 pm

Tinka ir darytos. Svarbu, kad butu tinkamas diametras, aukstis ir kietumas, o ne random, nes bandau pagaliau tvarkingai vaziuokle pasidaryt. Man idomu suzinot is kur zmones gauna spyruokles visiem tiem savadarbiam aukscio reguliavimam.
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Re: [all] Koilines spyruokles. Kur pirkti?

Post by Mariuzzzz » Tue Apr 16, 2013 7:13 pm

Buvo zmogus bmw klubo forume pardavinejo arba yra imoniu uzsiimanciu spyruokliu gamyba gali padaryti pagal tavo parametrus ilgi, stori, viju stori, kietuma ir t.t. Pabandyk pagooglinti kaipnors "spyruokliu gamyba" ar pan tikrai kazka rasi.
Geriau pilvas nuo alaus, nei kupra nuo darbo :D

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Re: [all] Koilines spyruokles. Kur pirkti?

Post by samis_p » Tue Apr 16, 2013 7:21 pm

Buvau rades, bet man sunku patiket, kad firma imsis daryt 4 vienetus spyruokliu ir bus pigiau, nei pirkt dideliais kiekiais gaminama produkta. Na, reikes tada ziuret ka daryt... Keista. USA tai pilnas pasirinkimas kokiu tik nori, tik kad siuntimas brangus. Net kainos ir tos mazos.
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Re: [all] Koilines spyruokles. Kur pirkti?

Post by Mariuzzzz » Tue Apr 16, 2013 8:02 pm

Neberandu to zmogaus is klubo temos, bet radau maila. Office@suspension.lt spyruokles kaina ~120 priklauso nuo parametru. Pranesk kaip sekesi, nes ir paciam greit reiks :)
Geriau pilvas nuo alaus, nei kupra nuo darbo :D

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Re: [all] Koilines spyruokles. Kur pirkti?

Post by samis_p » Tue Apr 16, 2013 9:54 pm

Ok aciu, reikes parasyt laiska. Duosiu zinot, kai ka nors atrasys.
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Re: [all] Koilines spyruokles. Kur pirkti?

Post by _marshall_ » Wed Apr 17, 2013 1:47 pm

spyruokles.lt

Man gavosi apie 150 su cinkavimu. + atskirai ground controlus dariausi.
Siaip kaina pagrinde nuo vielos kiekio priklauso, kaip supratau.

Apsiskaiciuot galima cia: http://www.acxesspring.com/spring-calculator.html

Laukti reikia ilgai, uz savo apskaiciavimus atsakingi patys, gali susesti, suluzti, vadinasi blogai apsiskaiciavot.

Geriau sumoket daugiau ir gaminti per suprantanti zmogu: pawla, lenca ar pan. Jie jau yra isbande, isdirbe ir galesit dar pa**st prota, jeigu sulus per pirma vaziavima.
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Re: [all] Koilines spyruokles. Kur pirkti?

Post by samis_p » Thu Apr 18, 2013 4:40 pm

Na, is suspension.lt kol kas jokio atsakymo. Paziurejau ta kalkuliatoriu, tai ten ir diametrus ir visa kita reikia zinot. Mane domina kietumas, aukstis ir diametras, daugiau nenoreciau list. Manau patys turetu zinot kokio diametro viela naudot, kad atitiktu reikalingus duomenis. 150lt cia uz vieneta? Ar cia 150eur uz visas? Ground controlus turiu, todel ir domina tik spyruokles.
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Re: [all] Koilines spyruokles. Kur pirkti?

Post by _marshall_ » Fri Apr 19, 2013 11:38 am

samis_p wrote:Na, is suspension.lt kol kas jokio atsakymo. Paziurejau ta kalkuliatoriu, tai ten ir diametrus ir visa kita reikia zinot. Mane domina kietumas, aukstis ir diametras, daugiau nenoreciau list. Manau patys turetu zinot kokio diametro viela naudot, kad atitiktu reikalingus duomenis. 150lt cia uz vieneta? Ar cia 150eur uz visas? Ground controlus turiu, todel ir domina tik spyruokles.
Litu uz abi :)
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[23:51:46] Titas: ** padangos tiek galines tiek priekines...... (y) marshalas seima planuoja geros gumos nebereikia :D
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Re: [all] Koilines spyruokles. Kur pirkti?

Post by romkasponka » Fri Apr 19, 2013 12:29 pm

Neisradinekit dviracio, nes niekas nepadarys geriau nei profai tik pakabai gaminantys spyruokles. O jie uz kokybe garantuoja ir galu gale viska tikrina pagamine, kad parametrai atitiktu tokius kokie suprojektuoti.
http://www.dfaulknersprings.com/ cia pigiausia ka esu mates...
FK automotive dar parduoda coilams spyruokles, bet tinklapyje nevisada pavyksta surasti, o popieriniame kataloge yra, bet pasirinkimas nera didelis. Pirkau is ju "helperius".
Mano asmeniskai pasirinkimas H-R. Sumokesit 30% daugiau, bet turesit kokybiska ir patikrinta produkta. Xtra racing gali pasiulyti.
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Re: [all] Koilines spyruokles. Kur pirkti?

Post by Mariuzzzz » Fri Apr 19, 2013 2:31 pm

_marshall_ wrote:spyruokles.lt

Man gavosi apie 150 su cinkavimu. + atskirai ground controlus dariausi.
Siaip kaina pagrinde nuo vielos kiekio priklauso, kaip supratau.

Apsiskaiciuot galima cia: http://www.acxesspring.com/spring-calculator.html

Laukti reikia ilgai, uz savo apskaiciavimus atsakingi patys, gali susesti, suluzti, vadinasi blogai apsiskaiciavot.

Geriau sumoket daugiau ir gaminti per suprantanti zmogu: pawla, lenca ar pan. Jie jau yra isbande, isdirbe ir galesit dar pa**st prota, jeigu sulus per pirma vaziavima.
Kaina jei uz abi labai gera, per ka tu dareis?
Geriau pilvas nuo alaus, nei kupra nuo darbo :D

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Re: [all] Koilines spyruokles. Kur pirkti?

Post by _marshall_ » Fri Apr 19, 2013 3:07 pm

Spyruokles.lt

Siaip pritarciau romkai. Skaiciavausi, dariausi, iskart susedo, gavosi A**UJIENAI kietos ir t.t. Geraiu pamoket daugiau ir jei ne normalaus gamintojo pirkt, tai bent uzsakinet per tuos, kurie supranta. Pawla, Lenca. Nei vazinet keliolika kartu, nei skaiciuot, ir dar garantuotas esi, kad ne promacha perki...
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[23:51:46] Titas: ** padangos tiek galines tiek priekines...... (y) marshalas seima planuoja geros gumos nebereikia :D
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Re: [all] Koilines spyruokles. Kur pirkti?

Post by samis_p » Fri Apr 19, 2013 10:27 pm

romkasponka wrote:Neisradinekit dviracio, nes niekas nepadarys geriau nei profai tik pakabai gaminantys spyruokles. O jie uz kokybe garantuoja ir galu gale viska tikrina pagamine, kad parametrai atitiktu tokius kokie suprojektuoti.
http://www.dfaulknersprings.com/ cia pigiausia ka esu mates...
FK automotive dar parduoda coilams spyruokles, bet tinklapyje nevisada pavyksta surasti, o popieriniame kataloge yra, bet pasirinkimas nera didelis. Pirkau is ju "helperius".
Mano asmeniskai pasirinkimas H-R. Sumokesit 30% daugiau, bet turesit kokybiska ir patikrinta produkta. Xtra racing gali pasiulyti.
As ir ziurejau Faulkner's, bet ne tiesiai is ju, o is jjcraceandrally.com - ten dar ir kainos kiek mazesnes, nei pirkt tiesiai is faulkner. H&R is xtra man netinka, nes mano turimi ground controlai skirti 2.5" spyruoklem, o pas juos 60mm, be to jie net nesugeba kainu susirasyt i kainorasti... Panasu, kad teks megint faulknerius.
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Re: [all] Koilines spyruokles. Kur pirkti?

Post by romkasponka » Sat Apr 20, 2013 12:46 am

samis_p wrote:As ir ziurejau Faulkner's, bet ne tiesiai is ju, o is jjcraceandrally.com - ten dar ir kainos kiek mazesnes, nei pirkt tiesiai is faulkner. H&R is xtra man netinka, nes mano turimi ground controlai skirti 2.5" spyruoklem, o pas juos 60mm, be to jie net nesugeba kainu susirasyt i kainorasti... Panasu, kad teks megint faulknerius.
Del H-R pasiziurek H-R tinklapyje, nes man regis jie turetu gaminti ir colines, o kai zinosi konkrecia spyruokle tai manau gali pasukti jiems ir jie tau pasakys kaina. Orientacines gali pabandyti www.sandtler.de susirasti. Aisku nekainuos pigiau nei Faulkners....
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Re: [all] Koilines spyruokles. Kur pirkti?

Post by samis_p » Sat Apr 20, 2013 1:37 am

O kokio aukscio spyruokle siulai i gala? As siuo metu ieskau ~115N/mm ir 4" aukscio, tik bijau kad nebutu LABAI per zema. Kitur 5" aukscio pardavineja koilu komplektuose, tai biski pasimetes.
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Re: [all] Koilines spyruokles. Kur pirkti?

Post by _marshall_ » Sat Apr 20, 2013 11:35 am

cia gatvei, ar sportui? man kazkaip lyg minkstokai atrodo...
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Re: [all] Koilines spyruokles. Kur pirkti?

Post by romkasponka » Sat Apr 20, 2013 1:30 pm

"Stock M3 -> 140 /250
Dinan Sport -> 172/ 300
H&R Race -> 315/ 570
H&R Sport -> 185/ 380
Eibach Pro-kit -> 102/ 277
Eibach Race -> 160/ 445
Ireland Stage 3 -> 315/570"
lb/in

group N 685/1027lb/in 120/180Nmm asfaltinis, bet vaziuojama su slikais ir neaisku kokio lygumo keliais. Sitas gal netgi perkietas Kacerginei.

Jei ziuresit visokius DTM tai del galiniu nedarykit klaidos, nes ten spyruokle tiesiai ant amortiko, o tai yra didelis skirtumas...

Kokio ilgio rinktis spyruokle reikia skaiciuotis. H-R duoda kokia eiga turi spyruokle konkreti. Kiek ji suses galima pasiskaiciuoti jei zinomi svoriai priekines ir galines asies. Vienzo pasidarot Exelyje skaiciuokle ir pirmyn ;)

p.s. jei norit pasiskaiciuoti kokias spyruokles deti:

Natural Frequency [CPM - cycles per minute] =
187.8 times {square root of (wheel rate [lb/in] divided by sprung weight [lb])}

Wheel Rate = Coil Rate [lb/in] divided by {suspension leverage raised to the second power}
(Low leverages - MacPherson struts - mean that wheel rates are approximately the same as coil rates.)

Since the tire is also a spring acting in series with the coil, you can take it into consideration by calculating:

Reciprocal value of combined spring rate [lb/in] =
reciprocal value of coil rate [lb/in] + reciprocal value of tire rate [lb/in]

Tire Rate = say 1,500 lb/in

Suspension Frequency values:
60-80 for comfortable road cars
80-100 for firmer and sport suspension
100-175 for non-ground effect racers
Sky is the limit for Formula 1 with minimum suspension movement

In order to avoid uncontrollable pitching, the front frequency is 10 to 20 CPM lower than the rear frequency.

Progressive springs are highly desirable for traction and road holding. Progressive springs will result in a softer suspension at full droop (e.g. on landing after a jump or a bump) and much stiffer suspension at full compression in order the delay (not to completely eliminate) grounding to higher G levels.

When designing the suspension, care has to be taken to divide the useful stroke of the shock absorber correctly between the bump and rebound. Adjustable spring perches do not automatically solve this. For instance, a higher preload on the spring will result in more bump and less rebound.

Special notes:
1. All of the above will be more difficult to do for progressive springs since you do not have a single value of rate like for linear springs and it will prove to be impossible to do it correctly unless you obtain the deflection diagram for each progressive coil from the manufacturer.
2. Typically, in order to get a progressive rate coil with a sufficient crush length, you stack a linear coil on the top a progressive coil. Resulting combined coil rate is calculated as follows:
Reciprocal value of the combined coil rate = the sum of the reciprocal values of the two coil rates
The correctly designed progressive coil will work through the whole useful stroke of your shock absorber.
3. Beware of progressive "helper" coils which are fully crushed at the ride height or sooner! As you can see, they result in a linear rate suspension for the most part of the suspension movement!
Last edited by romkasponka on Sun Apr 21, 2013 5:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: [all] Koilines spyruokles. Kur pirkti?

Post by samis_p » Sat Apr 20, 2013 7:11 pm

Masina megejiskom varzybom neaiskiais keliais (visokie seni aerodromai ir t.t.) bei karts nuo karto mieste isvaziuot 4fun. As ziurejau pagal Vorshlag coilu duomenis, tai pas juos butent tokie pasirinkimai:
Vorshlag's GT Package is 6" x 500 #/in Front / 5" x 550 #/in Rear
Vorshlag's GTS Package is 6" x 550 #/in Front / 5" x 650 #/in Rear
Vorshlag's GTR package is 6" x 600 #/in Front, 5" x 750 #/in Rear
USA forumuose atsiliepimai apie tuos coilus gan geri, tai manau kietumai turetu but labai i tema.
Pirmas variantas gatvei, antras gatvei su trupuciu trasos ir trecias grynai trasai. Manau variantai geri, nes kiek teko pereit ale zeminanciu spyruokliu komplektu, tai pas mane visada galas auksciau nei priekis - ir gerokai auksciau. Skaiciuot nesinori, nes ne toks gudragalvis, kad pradeciau pats sau skaiciuot spyruokles. Skaiciau uzsienio forumus, ka zmones deda, kas jiem tinka, kas nelabai ir apsistojau ties jau auksciau duotais skaiciais. Vienintele problema buvo gaut spyruokles. Parasiau i xtra del Eibach, blogiausiu atveju pirksiu faulkners ir tures but gerai.
Marshall, kietesniu spyruokliu kazkaip nelabai noriu, nes, mano ziniom, amortizatoriai gali nesusitvarkyt su jom. Jau ir taip sitos ~3x kietesnes nei stock.
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Re: [all] Koilines spyruokles. Kur pirkti?

Post by _marshall_ » Sat Apr 20, 2013 7:21 pm

115 n/mm tris kart kieciau uz org? Kad org lyg apie 80 n/mm. As praeita vasara vazinejau su mazdaug 170 n/mm tai atrode kad gerai, tik kad spyruokles trumpos, eigos buvo mazoka ir vija i vija dauzes.
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